2024 OA Steps 8 and 9

[00:00:02] Speaker A: I give it serenity to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things I can, and wisdom to know the difference. Thy will, not mine be done. The topic of this workshop is steps 8 and 9. My name is Michael, I'm a food addict and I'm seated with Megan who is. I are both co leaders of this session. Each of us will have up to 20 minutes to speak and then we'll open the room for shares for up to three minutes. This session is being recorded. Okay, so I love step nine. It's my favorite one. Our timer. Debbie. [00:00:51] Speaker B: Great. [00:00:56] Speaker A: Like the first go over the promises and they're really germane to steps eight and nine. You know, when we hear it in meetings it's, you know, but they're in this case they're taken out of context. And what I mean by that is if we are painstaking about this phase of our development, we will be amazed before we are halfway through. Well, if you're reading the book, you know that that comes up. Hat phase is steps eight and nine. And halfway through is we will be amazed before we were Halfway through steps 8 and 9 we have these promises. I found the Cleveland AA website lists them as 12. I've always counted them and I've only been able to get 11 out of them. But anyway, we are going to know a new freedom and a new happiness. We will not regret the past nor wish to shut the door on it. We will comprehend the word serenity. We will know peace. That's how they did it. They made those two. No matter how far down the scale we have gone, we will see how our experience can benefit others. That feeling of uselessness and self pity will disappear. We will lose interest in selfish things and gain interest in our fellows. Self seeking will slip away. Our whole attitude and outlook upon life will change. Fear of people and economic insecurity will leave us. We will intuitively know how to handle situations which used to baffle us. We will suddenly realize that God is doing for us what we could not do for ourselves. I remember I complained to one of my early sponsors why the promise is not coming true for me. And the answer was clear. To the extent you believe that they're actual literal promises and that's a choice for everyone to make. They're not made. These promises are not given until we're talking about the ninth step. And I hadn't done the ninth step. So of course I hadn't received. I hadn't paid to get what I wanted back in return. So I do like I love the Steps metaphor. You know, if you're on a flight of 12 stairs and you take up one step and you look around, the view is basically the same. It's a little different, but almost imperceptible. But you get up to like six or seven, and then, you know, you're looking down on people's heads. You can see the little dust motes that are hanging from the ceiling. And by the time you get to 12, the entire view has changed. The entire view. So when I say I love the 9th step, I could not have gotten there without the first eight and the ones that come after. I remember when I. One of the first people I talked to in program was a high school student. My brother was a teacher at a private girls high school. I was just getting into this. I came into the room, by the way, because a healthcare professional sent me here. I would urge you to tell your healthcare professional that it's helping you so that they can tell people about us. But I remember I said I didn't want to do all of them, the steps. And I don't remember. It was a very long time ago. It's almost 40 years ago, but I don't remember which one it was. But I remember she held up the big book and she slapped her hand. Dude, the first one. That's the only one you got to do. That image just sticks in my head. So they're all important in my experience. But the ninth one for me is the one that made the difference that I could discern. I like this metaphor of a hose. If you think of a hose that has pressure on and dozens of tiny pinpricks, this thing where if you run your hand over it, it almost doesn't over one of these little jets. It's almost like your hand doesn't even get wet. There's nothing really coming out. I mean, you could see it, but it's so imperceptible. But if you take all of those imprints, they're letting out a significant amount of the energy that's going through the hose. That's how I experienced what the ninth step addressed. The eighth and ninth steps addressed all these things that I had in my past that I had regrets about. You know, I used to call them winces. And by what I mean is, I'd be driving down the street and I'd see a, you know, Chevy Nova. And I think, oh, yeah, Chevy Nova, John. Ooh, the wince, you know, because I remembered what had happened that time. And by doing the ninth step, I was able to basically Stop all those holes. Now, each one of them was not really taking that much of my energy, but altogether I was losing a lot of energy that I could have applied to my daily life that was draining away from stuff that had happened in the past and could not be changed. And that's, you know, I'm pretty sure I told that high school student, I don't want to do the nine step. That deflating, it's embarrassing, whatever it is. I didn't want. I didn't sound like fun. And it's the one that I love the most. Now, I had more than 400 people on my resentment list, and that's not including the principal and the institutions. And a lot of people had more than one. So I had substantially more. But I only had 52 people on my amends list. My sponsor told me to make three lists. People I'm willing to make amends to, people I would make amends to if I could find them, and people that I'm not willing to make amends to. I want to make clear. I had this confusion. I was an editor as a vocation for decades, and I thought amend meant to apologize. But, you know, we know like in the states, we have the amendments to the Constitution, those are not apologies. [00:07:10] Speaker C: Those. [00:07:10] Speaker A: Those are changes. Amend means to change now for the people who are still in my life. What that meant was that I needed not only to make this expression of regret and be very clear about what I had done in a way that I would not have wanted to be treated. I had a change as well to no longer treat people that way. But Most of the 52 were people from my past. And there was not a lot I could change. I mean, substantial to me. I told you how much I feel that I got out of it. But it's not like I could, you know, if I had been mean to them, I could be nice or not, because they're not in my life anymore. Really, all I can change is to reframe what happened as instead of just some guy was a jerk to me to some guy was a jerk to me. But he eventually came around and acknowledged it. And I feel better that he acknowledged it. That's the change I can make. I will say the Internet really helped. You know, it's now, but I mean, when I was doing this 25 years ago, it was able to find a lot of people that I wanted to make amends to by Googling them. So it's a really powerful tool that might not have been available to previous generations of people in callstep programs. It's still true though. That guy on bus or Tony, whose last name I never knew is still hard to find. But I'll tell you, but I will tell you, I thought for the first time in a long time I was in Minneapolis at the beginning of the month and in the crowd I thought I saw Tony and it wasn't. But I can tell you I was fully, am fully ready to make that amend. I would love the opportunity to make every amendment that I have because there's something in it for me. I mean, it's a reward. I get to. I think of myself. If you know me, you can judge me for yourself, but as a much more loving person. And this is an expression of love toward another person. Yeah, I wasn't great, but I acknowledge that I wasn't great and I want to make it right. I had, As I said, 52 people. There were only two on the list that I didn't want to make amend to. And I've had experiences like this other times in my recovery where I never decided to make. Honestly, that's not true. I never talked myself into making those two amends. I went about. I've heard the advice and you start with easy ones. And I went about it. And at some point during my process, I no longer was unwilling to make amends for the other two. And it just. What I said earlier about the steps, you don't jump to the fifth step on a staircase. And as you're changing, as you're going through the steps, you start to. I started to be willing to do things, to be different, materially different, as the way I re interacted with the world as a result of what I had done already. And that was true in my nine step amendment. Some nuts and bolts about how I did it. Thank you. When I reached out to someone, especially somebody who wasn't in my life, I just like sent an email. Maybe I called, maybe I did both, saying I would like 10 minutes of your time and I can promise you I won't try to sell you anything. And that seemed to work. I didn't want to make the amends on the phone or I didn't want to make it a cold call. You know, I wanted them to be aware that I was reaching out to them and that I had something that I wanted to say to them. The time came to do the amends. I tried not to have any preamble. The big book talks about when it's talking about the ninth step, perhaps it's best not to lead with the spiritual aspect of it in the ring, that's called with leading with the chin. And I took that one step further. I didn't even want to say I joined a 12 step program. And they say that I have to do this. I think that makes it less effective. The big book says, surely anyone will welcome someone who wants to make right or wrong. And that's all I needed to do. And, you know, if somebody wanted to know, I wasn't. It's not a secret. I just didn't want to, like, make some justification for why I was there more than I was wrong. I regret how I acted. And I wanted to talk to you about that one woman I reached out to right after I was done. Her first words were, are you dying? So in that case, I explained that of course I am. We all are. But not today. But this is why I'm doing this. So if somebody asks, fine. You know, I'm not hiding anything. I'm not. My point is that I was not trying to make up a justification for being there. The important part was I am here because of the way I acted. One guy who said, you know, I appreciate it and you know, I'm happy to listen to you and good to talk to you, but I really hope you weren't carrying around this wait for all these years, because it was nothing to me. And I found that, you know, several times I do want to make clear they weren't all like that. There was someone who I dated three different times and I wanted to make amends for the way the first one ended. And she said, well, that's really great, Michael. Thank you very much. Now let's talk about the third one, which is fine. You know, it's not like you're there to just sit there as a stone and take in whatever I have to say and then I walk up. That's not how it works. I'm trying to make a connection. And so that's what we needed to talk about. And so we did. And we have a better relationship now. Not active, but, you know, we see each other once in a while. That kind of. Now I definitely wanted every single person I went to to A, love me. B, be wicked impressed with the thing that I was doing for them. And that's just true about me. I want you all to like me a lot too, but that's not the point. My job was to clean up my side of the street if they, you know, well, or they threw me out of their office. It didn't. It's not that it didn't matter. I still feel it either way. But my job is to come and talk about my side of the street. And if I've done that, then I completed that part of my ninth step. Regardless of how the person reacts, I'm not there to get permission from them to stop feeling bad or anything like that. So, like, I make my amends and they're react angrily. I'm not as happy about that. But I still did my job and I can't. You know, I heard somebody in another meeting today read this part about. Oh, it was Dr. Paul. You know, Shakespeare said, the world is a stage and we're all players. You know, I'm not there to direct you how to respond. I'm there to do what I can do and then step back. That's all I can do, I guess. You know, I just want to reiterate mostly what I have to say. I am eager to meet every single person that was on my list. You know, I feel bad. Thank you. I feel bad that there's, you know, one person even, you know, it's not just one person, but that there's one person out in the world that I didn't treat well and that I can't do anything about it anymore. And you know, what I found in program, Somebody remember what it was. But, you know, the idea that we come in a program, most of us tend to lose weight and the things we get. First of all, I'm maintaining 160 pound loss. And I'm wicked happy about that. I don't want to say that, you know, it's not about the weight. It's not about the weight once the weight's off. But until it's, it's definitely about the weight. But I had a friend who I used to go to meetings with for years who would say if all I got out of this program was weight loss, it would be a stinking gyp. And it's true. All the things that I've gotten in addition to the weight loss, as I said, love is an active thing in my life. I pray every morning not only this, but please, God, fill me to overflowing with your love so that I cannot possibly help but splash it on every living creature that I come in contact with. And I didn't. I don't know really where that came from. I guess it's just like everything else, evolution. But I didn't set out to write a prayer like that. And somebody didn't tell me, here's this prayer. You should do this. It just developed this idea of doing the ninth step for me is spreading love in the world, especially in places where I didn't do that before. And like I told that high school student, well, I don't want to do that one. I didn't know. I didn't know. It was really a great experience for me. And anyone who is not at that point in their recovery yet, I would say race toward it. I'll also say I didn't do that, so don't do it like I did, but race toward it. It has tangible benefit that keeps paying forever. And I'm really grateful for the program and for this part of it especially. Thank you. [00:17:57] Speaker B: I'm Megan. I'm a compulsive overeater. Hi. So guided the steps with my sponsor. Here's the way I did it. I made that chart like in the big book four step, like who hurt me, what the effects in me. And that same type of chart and the. And I didn't want to. It took me seven years before I started the steps. The reason it took me seven years before I started the steps was because I did not want to do step nine. I felt like a failure, tremendous failure, 100% failure, wrong on everything. Very low self esteem. And I thought if I have to go to somebody and say I'm sorry, I was wronged, wrong, wrong, wrong, and I couldn't even get any lower. That's how I figured. I was 60 pounds heavier than I am today and I was binging on sugar all the time. And even in the program I mentioned before, it took me 11 years to stop binging. And I just couldn't believe it that they would ask me to debase myself. That's how I felt. And so my sponsor, I was ready to stop at step seven to remove, humbly ask God to remove my defects. That's just before 8. And my main character defect was people pleasing. [00:19:45] Speaker D: I was low. [00:19:49] Speaker B: I felt I would not essentially live or nobody would talk to me really, and say yes to everything. That's really how I felt, like a zero. I did not have a self. I had other people's self that they felt for me, which I was failing at. And I was fat. Sorry, but I don't think that's literally correct anymore, to use that word. But I was 60 pounds heavier and binging, binging and binging on sugar. [00:20:24] Speaker A: Oh, my God. [00:20:25] Speaker B: And so my sponsors, you know, I told them I didn't want to stop, you know, people pleasing because nobody would be around me. And he said, well, then I can't go on with you. And I thought that was. That was ridiculous. It already taken me through. I mean, I didn't get programmed almost forever, you know, And I've been in program 47 years, 48 years. I never got it really, you know, so I'm still like, fumbling sometimes. Should I do this, should I do that? Am I right, am I wrong? You know, this kind of thing. Not as much as before. And so he said he wouldn't stay with me. And I thought, my God, here's a person who, you know, spent like the last six months on the first, you know, set of steps. And he. I said, you wouldn't really leave me, would you? He said, yes, if you don't do this. So I thought, oh. The reason I'm saying that is because I said. And I like, faked it. And I said, you know, I was very nervous. And I said, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. I used a program epithet, none of which I like. And I said, well, what if I act as if I'm going to remove the defect of people pleasing? I thought, oh. He said, okay. But he was really suspicious, but you have to give it a good try. So I thought I got away with something. He said, just get on your knees and pray for the removal of the defective people. Which I did for seven years. So that worked. And that's actually how I under higher power. I got on my knees and I said, God, you and I both know that you're not there. And I got this big feeling in my chest that I never felt before in my life. Such warm feeling. I thought, oh, crap, I was wrong, you know, you are there, but I'm not telling anybody. And that's how I'm totally, like, rebellious like that. I'm. I can't even hardly listen to people, you know, who are not like, fighting, you know, resistant and trying to overcome it. I'm not that. I'm not that, you know, like, oh, you know, it was this way and it was that way. Like, God flew away with me. And I'm like, now on. I'm like really angelic wings. And everything is, you know, you know, And. And so anyway, I'm not that way. Oh, 15 minutes left. Okay, great. Okay. So the reason I say that. Whoops, sorry. The reason I say that is because I thought, you know, I can't fake it again because he's gonna threaten to leave me, that guy. So we went right into I did I and it. And not because it worked. Not because step seven worked. Didn't do it for that reason. I did it because I didn't want him to leave me. So we did step eight. And he said, make a list of all person fund. There were three people on the list. My mother, my father. I had a friend and she didn't like the word. She said people had called her harsh. And she was very controlling. And there was an occasion where I called her harsh. I couldn't think of any other word. And I needed to stop her from controlling me. And we never spoke again. I didn't care. It was painful, but I was fine. I said she hurt my feelings. I called her harsh. Do I owe her an amends? He said, no, she was off the list. The only people I ever made amends to in this formal way was my mother and separately my father. Only those two. And I'm really happy that I did that because they both died. And to my father, I wrote, I really love my father. I wrote, you know, I was sorry that I yelled at him and was rebellious about our religion. And you know, his response was, I thought, this is actually going to be like dying, actually, because he was like really having a hard time keeping with this thing. And I thought. And he was crying and he didn't, you know, big, you know, man. He didn't want to cry. So I mistook and I thought, oh, Anan, he's crying. I didn't know what to do with that. So I thought, oh, no. I thought, well, you know, it's really hard to see your father cry. He was a really lovely man. So that worked out really nicely. And my mother came and we were in a restaurant, abstinent, absent. And I gave her my amends. And I was. So she put me down pretty much, you know, or said I was wrong about pretty much everything. I was afraid of her. And I had that. And then I think I wrote on my hand and I definitely had the paper that I had written the eight sepiments out, you know, on my paper on my pocketbook, like propped up, like, you know, pumped up there. So if I needed to, I could just look at the side and maybe see it. I couldn't really see it. You know, it was little too small. I just couldn't, you know, it should have been bigger to see it, but I had there as a fail safe and I practiced it. One thing in the eighth step when I wrote it that my sponsor changed. I said, I'm sure that you did the best that you could. He changed that to, I know you did the best. I thought, I don't want to change it. They're my words. It's my mother. I'm doing the amends. I don't want to change it. He said, well, you're not ready if you don't. What is the big deal? The word short, the word no. [00:26:25] Speaker E: It's the same thing. [00:26:26] Speaker B: At least 35 years to figure out it's not the same thing. Know is really deeper than, oh, I'm sure you did the right thing. I'm sure of it. [00:26:37] Speaker A: I'm sure. [00:26:38] Speaker B: Don't worry about. No, I know you did the right thing. I thought, okay. I really still didn't want to say it, you know, but I did because, you know, he just was about to leave me in the last dud. I'm not, you know, tracking that anymore. So I made. I made amends to my mother, and I told her I was sorry I yelled at her when I was younger. Let me tell you this. Before she died, she said, in the nursing home, you yelled at me. I had already made this amends, like, I don't know, 1980s something. She died in 2020. She remembered, and that amends did not change her memory. [00:27:21] Speaker D: Thank you. [00:27:22] Speaker B: You know, I did it wrong. I did the best I could. And I was trying to. An old therapist said, like, you know, stay away from her and get her away from me by resisting and yelling. [00:27:35] Speaker F: And that kind of thing. [00:27:36] Speaker B: So I just was like, you know, I wasn't a namby pamby as a people pleaser. I would have succumbed to her. If I didn't push back, my pushback was negative to her. It would have been negative to anybody. That's over. So the end of my amends to my mother, she said, oh, well, I wish that you. She said, it was so lovely. I didn't want to come in because it was going to rain. And I thought, oh, God, I don't know what's happening. And your father said, you know, it would be a pleasant experience. So I came anyway. So I thought, okay, I don't know what to do with that. So I thought that was nice. That was nice. Then she said, you know, I hope that you find a nice Jewish man. I hope that you get married and have, you know, a good experience. And I hated that. I had looked for like 25 or 30 years for that, and I was still now bad. And I didn't have what I knew she always wanted from me, that I wanted for me that I didn't have. And I was being now told again that failed to achieve something. Oh, my God, that was awful. And I just. Especially when you're like vulnerable and you've just done that stuff like that. So I also, I was, you know, reading the book, you know, the 12 step book. And it says in step eight, I want to make sure everybody knows. As much as we might like to, we cannot skip the making of amends if we want freedom from compulsive. They call it eating for me is overeating. Yeah, that was my main goal in life, was freedom. Pretty much freedom from everything. And in the program it translates to me as power of choice. I'm free make a choice. That's my gold. That is my gold. And I can choose to say yes and I can choose to say no. But before program I could not. There was no yes. There was no no. I would have to say yes to everything. All I had to do was continue to continue to say yes to everything was binge eat like crazy. [00:30:03] Speaker A: Five minutes. [00:30:03] Speaker B: Here's my amends to myself I wrote out today. Dear Megan, we are together here alone. I know your suffering goes way back and even now hits your stomach. We know we are higher powering together. It's relief that comes from true recognition. I recognize and admire you for your beauty, how pretty you are. What a great personality. With all the interior weight and self deprecation corroborated. It's true. From the outside you have gained more happiness and givingness than you ever thought possible. You have in the main peace of mind. You were always this person and tried to act this way, but seemed to be blunted at every turn. Now you have changed because of the work you have done in OA, the steps, the sponsors, sponsoring meetings, etc. You know how to behave toward yourself and therefore how to behave toward others. This is my amends to you. You changed to know you not fixed them. They do not want to hear your answers. They, like you, want freedom to be who they are, how they think. God will take care of them, not me. I deliver my sentences as if no one has to do whatever I say. Thank you for this change. On the other hand, I do not, to the extent possible, allow others to tell me what to do. Unless I'm paying them for training. I am still rebellious. I thank you for that. An amends for a people pleaser to be rebellious. While most of it can be called taking care of myself, what you have really restored is the power of choice. The power of choice extends both from and to the choice over food. Sugary food. What? And amends that these foods are not your brain and your body, as if you needed them to live. Like you did in the past. The fear, for the most part, the fear that drove the comfort need for sugary foods is lifted. Thank you for amending that. Hard work. Well thought striving always. I envision my fear going up like those Japanese lanterns people fly when someone dies. A lot of my fear has died. It was a protection I no longer need. God is handling me. What a life. Thank you God for my freedom, my lovely life greatness. Thank you. [00:33:25] Speaker A: This workshop will end at 3:30 and for the rest of the time we'll hear three minute pitches from the floor. The timer, Debbie will still you when you have one minute left. If you would like to share, please come to the front of the room. Please remind. Excuse me. We remind you that the session is being recorded and your sharing demonstrates your consent to be recorded. Wish to remain anonymous. Please use a fictitious name or Excuse me or choose not to share. Please say where you are from and how long you've been in OA, but devote your share to your OAX strength and hope on the topic which is step 8 and 9. The meeting is now open for sharing. Please come and form a line over here. Well, if any. If you want to share. [00:34:12] Speaker C: Hi, I'm Sheri. [00:34:13] Speaker G: I'm a compulsive overeater. I've been in program since 2005 and there was many times that I went through the program and my first sponsor said to me, if you always do what you always did, you'll always get what you always got. And that stuck with me all these years. And what kept me out of the rooms was doing step four because I never wanted to face it. And what scared me even more was making the list of all the harms and then doing the actual amends because I didn't want to admit that I actually had done these things to people. The reason why I came up here is because recently I did a knife step with my son who's 27. And he was a very rebellious teenager. You know, I would tell him he couldn't go out and he would jump out his window. We had like a landing that was like landscape. And he would, you know, he would jump out the window and you know, I would get calls from the principal and they would say, hi, Ms. McGarry, I just want to let you know that everything's okay. Kyle's fine, but you know, we can't find him in the school, you know, and so, you know, trials and tribulations. But what was my part in it? So, you know, my part in it was that I Wanted to control him. And so many fears and so many harms that I did to him while trying to control him. And so recently, you know how we make that list of all the people that we wanted You. I always wanted to do the amends with him, but I couldn't find the courage. And my sponsor said to me, you're never going to be fully recovered if you don't do everyone on your list that you want to do on your list. So recently, I did the amends with him, and he didn't want me to do the amends with him. [00:36:23] Speaker B: He was like, mom, you don't need to do this. Mom, you don't need to do this. [00:36:26] Speaker G: And I said, I need to do it because for my recovery, this will help me to clear my side of the street. And I said, what I mean by that is that there were things that. [00:36:38] Speaker B: I did to you. [00:36:40] Speaker G: You know, I tried to control you. I tried to test you and trick you to try to do the right thing. He's like, mom, why did you do all those things? And I said to him, I said, because I wanted you to do the right thing because I loved you. He's like, exactly. And he does sales. He's a salesman for a Living. He's 27. And it was just funny the way he tried to sell it back to me that, mom, it wasn't your fault. And I can't tell you how long it took me to do this amends with him. And I'm out of time, so thanks for letting me share. [00:37:25] Speaker H: Hi, everyone. Lindsey P. Hello. Compulsive Eda from New York recovered just for today. I love talking about 8 and 9. I can just talk forever on it. It really changed my life. It set me free from just the unresolved trauma and guilt and shame that I was living with when I came in this program. I just want to say that when I started stepi, I had very little willingness, but it says to make a list of those I've harmed. So I was able to make the list. And then it said, become willing. And I just kept praying for the willingness and praying for the willingness. And I thought at the beginning of step eight, like, I'm never going to have that willingness. I really don't like admitting I'm wrong. And I was so just. God is the hero of that story because I was just so grateful when I had the willingness to make amends for just such terrible decisions that I made coming into this program or leading up to coming into this program. You know, I realized that it's not just a list. A powerful inventory and allowed me to grow and change. And when I started admitting that I was wrong, I was able to sleep better at night and I was able to take accountability. You know, I had to go into stores like Target and tell them that I had stolen. I did things like there was, like when I was in my early 20s and I'm in my early 40s now, I would steal from all different Sephora's in the city. There was no way I could go back and start figuring out what I stole from where. But I would donate like Sephora items to people that were in need who could have used a lift or something, you know, just like who could have used that TLC in their lives. So I had to start getting creative with my sponsor on how to make amends. That was more difficult because not everything's so clear cut. It's tough because my life, I always really got a lot out of being the victim. And looking at my. Looking at my amends list made me really see my own accountability and take responsibility and swipe my side of the street. And I made amends to people. My biggest amends had to be to my husband for having a very long affair with a married man. And I'm saying that because I want to give that honesty. And it's been very tough knowing that he still struggles and we've worked very hard to continue to grow in our marriage. But I want to share that because there have been very hard moments over the last three years of us working towards recovery. And I have to realize that I don't have to live in guilt and shame anymore. I made the amends. And sometimes he can be angry and he can have his feelings and he's allowed those feelings, but I don't need to take them on as I'm a bad person anymore. I can honor his feelings and validate them without living in that guilt and shame that I did for a long time. So I just wanted to share that truth and honesty. And with that, I'll task. [00:40:25] Speaker C: Thank you. [00:40:32] Speaker E: I'm a grateful, recovering compulsive ovary addict. [00:40:34] Speaker C: And I'm abstinent today by the time. [00:40:40] Speaker E: I came today because I'm stuck on a nine step amendment. I don't eat no matter what. No matter what, I don't eat. I follow my food plan. I work on my tools. [00:40:49] Speaker B: That doesn't make me immune. [00:40:51] Speaker E: I still have a ton of work to do and I've done the process of big step study and I'm still making amends. And I had said to my sponsor recently, I said, you know, I'm looking. [00:41:01] Speaker C: Through my eight step list and you. [00:41:03] Speaker E: Know, I had done a lot of the direct ones, you know, to my. [00:41:05] Speaker A: Children, to my husband. [00:41:06] Speaker E: I had this long list of living amends and I was praying about it and I said, you know, something's not right here. It can't possibly be every single amend. [00:41:16] Speaker B: I have to make. [00:41:16] Speaker E: It's living amends that like not a direct. [00:41:19] Speaker B: So I really had to sit and. [00:41:20] Speaker E: Look at that as like am I avoiding facing some of these people? Because I don't want to be reminded, I don't want to feel shame, I don't want to feel bad about myself. And right after we talked about it then I had this epiphany of like a number of other people that I really did harm and I really do. [00:41:40] Speaker B: Need to go back. [00:41:40] Speaker E: And now I'm preying on those because one of the things that helped me tremendous, I had done the steps one way long process and now I did. [00:41:50] Speaker A: It through the big book steps, just. [00:41:51] Speaker E: Through the AWOL process. I tried to be in control and I didn't listen to a sponsor and I was told when she read my amend, she made it, you know, she made suggestions as to like, you may not want to say this, you may not want to say that. And I got uncomfortable in the moment when I was facing somebody and I said something and in 8 and 9, do not do more harm, not do more harm. And I actually harmed another person. Now I have a very sponsor who's very direct about what I should and shouldn't say and doesn't mean that I don't kick and scream and say, well. [00:42:23] Speaker H: These are my words and I want. [00:42:24] Speaker E: To be able to say this. Thank you. I just. Because left to my own devices, I'm going to end up harming another person when I make an amendment. [00:42:31] Speaker C: That's not the point. [00:42:32] Speaker E: Not about assuaging my guilt, it is about cleaning up my side of the street. So I'm learning, I'm still learning a day's time and I still have a fair amount of amendments to make and I'm just. [00:42:44] Speaker B: Thank you. [00:42:49] Speaker C: Thank you for all your stories. And I was sitting back there struggling whether I should share or not. And usually that means I was thinking about. I had made many face to face events and living events, but there was one that I couldn't come to terms with because I could not put my finger exactly on what the amends should be. And that was related to a 39 year marriage to an Alcoholic. So a lot of codependency on my part, a lot of damage done to the family, et cetera. And I had made the decision to forgive for many things. But I still. When it came to. After writing out an amend, I just. [00:43:31] Speaker A: Like, I kept asking. [00:43:32] Speaker C: God, I just don't know what it is. And what happened was I finally grew enough in myself that I was able. [00:43:39] Speaker D: To let my old guard down and. [00:43:40] Speaker C: Not be the victim anymore and be able to really see all the wonderful things that this man did for our family. And I'm telling you, that was like a huge thing. And I called him up, I said, can we meet? And he said, sure. So we met at Panera, and I used my script because I knew that I would get blubbery and maybe say some silly things. And I did not want to give him the impression that I had any intention of wanting to be with him again. I had to be very careful about that. I think it would have been something that he probably would have wanted. And what it boiled down to is he was an incredible provider. He provided us with a beautiful home. He took care of the yard. He took care of all of our cars. Just so good to my family. He was so good to my parents. Always there, helping, helping, helping. And I couldn't see any of that for a few years after I was in program. And I don't know. Thank you. I don't know. I know it was going to meetings and hearing people's other experiences that brought me to that point, but it was also that I had matured enough emotionally and had enough program work that I was. That it wasn't. That I was able to see my part. That's what it is. I didn't appreciate those things because I wasn't getting what I wanted out of the relationship. Affection, attention, things together. I wasn't getting any of that. But he did all these other wonderful things, and it was a real healing moment for me. I'm not sure what it was for him, but it was an overall great experience. Thank you. [00:45:40] Speaker I: Hi, good afternoon. [00:45:41] Speaker D: My name is Deirdre. I'm from Staten Island, New York. [00:45:44] Speaker F: Hi. [00:45:45] Speaker D: I'm a compulsive, and I've been in program for eight years. And thank you both for your shares. I wanted to touch on what you had mentioned, how amend means to change, and how changing something small changed something big for me. My mother, she's passed now, but she's probably one of the nicest, kindest people I've ever known. However, she also can be temperamental at times. When she's a little stressed, as many people can be. And we were visiting my brother and his family who live in North Carolina, and my parents, who have been divorced from 1980 was a family vacation, us visiting my brother and his family in North Carolina, which included both my parents and my sister and our respective daughters. And so my mother was. My parents were never besties, but always had a cordial relationship. But she started to get testy with me, and always she would get a little testy, and I would tell her, why are you acting like that? I didn't do anything. You know, I would be defensive and I would, you know, just be like reprimanding. And this, you know, was something that had gone on for years. You know, every time. I remember one time that she was probably going through menopause, so I should have been a little bit more sensitive. And we were in Target, and she was, you know, acting away. And I just had to say, you're not acting right. [00:47:48] Speaker A: La la la la la. [00:47:50] Speaker D: You know, so this time at my brother's house, when she said what she said, I don't even remember what it was. I said, oh, I'm sorry. I didn't mean to hurt your feelings or I didn't mean to upset you. You know, I apologize. And it ended it, you know, no escalation. And she relaxed because obviously she had been upset, so relaxed. And whatever I did or didn't do was now over. And that's how changing is really, the amends. Because the apology is only step one. And really that change made all the difference. Thank you. [00:48:47] Speaker A: Could I ask each of you to go two minutes instead of three so that we can end on time? [00:48:53] Speaker F: Gina Marie, powerless compulsive eater and food addict. And I heard a lot today about continuing, continuing this process. And recently I was looking at a step nine with my dad, who has passed. He passed in 2013. I came into 08 in 04 and my dad was one of the ones. I said, no, never. And I continued to hurt myself with food until my sponsor said, pray more for willingness. And I made amends to some degree over the years and I amended some of my relationship. But I realized over years that I never really got to the deeper levels of something I heard this morning in a conference that said, unconsciously I want to get back at the Perth by resisting, by holding back from them emotions. What I continue to without really realizing it. I got married in 2012 and I kind of shut my dad out of a lot of it because I figured he can't Handle it. He has Parkinson's dementia. I did all the things that it changes they were but yet inside to get to that deeper emotional feeling and to let him in on that level. I didn't see it until years later how much I hurt him that day not letting him in there and now what I can do when I say my name is Gina Marie, that's new to me because the Marie part was. [00:50:31] Speaker A: The name he gave me that he. [00:50:33] Speaker F: Always was so proud of and that point. And I wish I would have gotten to more of those deeper levels sooner so that I could have had this more with him and be willing when he was alive. [00:50:53] Speaker I: Hi, I'm Joanne Bouvier. [00:50:55] Speaker A: Cool. [00:50:57] Speaker I: I've never done that before. I'm not used to to being live with people in oa. Joanne B. I'll try and be quick about this. I love both of you. Megan, you touched me in a way. You spoke to me and I've heard a lot of things today. And basically I wrote in my book as I was listening to you, something occurred to me. Do I need to make an amend to myself? And then I heard you and to me that was you making amends to yourself. Because I share a lot of the same. The people pleasing, the putting people on pedestals, not speaking my truth. Those are all character defects for me. And recently I've had the last time I did amends or resentment list. I had two. Yeah, I'll be quick. I had two people on my list. One of them like in all appearances she had wronged me, she had judged me, etc. But I had to dig deep and I had to. What I learned was that I set myself up for that to happen and it was such a realization. And right now I have a situation at work where I need to step up and speak my truth and I have to say no. And it's going to be really hard. But it's just like I've got so many things going on in my brain. Anyway, it's just been wonderful revelation for me today. So I have to really look back and think about that and do a lot more journaling and deep thinking. So thank you. [00:52:55] Speaker A: That's all the time we have for sharing. Thank you for attending the workshop. We'll close with the Serenity prayer. God, grant me the serenity to accept a thing that cannot change, courage to change the things I can, and wisdom to know the difference. Thank you.